Noise in Render

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by MichaelSiggers » Wed Sep 06, 2017 6:32 pm

Good Evening

I'm fairly new to Thea Render, and have Thea Render for Sketchup installed.

While I've had the software for a few months, I've only really just started using it. I'm reading everything online, and also experimenting with it as well. I'm using models that I have already created for various clients.

One thing that I'm struggling with is Noise. I've attached an image of an internal rendering, which has been running for nearly an hour, but still is very grainy.

Any help, thoughts etc, would be much appreciated.

Kind regards

Mike
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Thea Screengrab.jpeg
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by Frederik » Wed Sep 06, 2017 8:38 pm

Without the scene - or some more information - this can be caused by several different things - and a combination of them... :|

I.e. is the emitters (being it IES-, spot- or omni-lights) sharing mesh with the model...?
What is the lightning source in your scene...?
How is the scene setup...? (is it just lit by the sun and then you've boosted the ISO and/or the shutter speed)
Although the scene seem fairly simple, what materials are in use...? (it can be an incorrect material setting)

Although it's difficult to see from the image you've posted, I'd say that the noise in this scene is most likely caused by one or two incorrect setups - or perhaps even a combination of both... (This is purely best guess based on loooong time experience)
1.) You're only using he Sun to light up this scene...
This will mean that the engine will have a hard time soling the dark areas, leading to these noisy renders...
2.) You've placed an emitter source behind a glass material - or perhaps too close to a mesh...
This will mean that the engine will need to calculate a lot, resulting in a noisy output...
Cheers
Kim Frederik

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-Malcolm X
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by Hieru » Wed Sep 06, 2017 9:53 pm

It looks like a simple enough scene. The best thing to do is share it as a Thea pack - then it should be easy to figure out the reason for the noise.
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by MichaelSiggers » Thu Sep 07, 2017 12:20 am

Thank you guys, for the replies.

Some more detail regarding the scene;

As can be seen, it's a kitchen area which is within a larger building, (I did wonder if this affects it, as would Thea still have to take into account items which can't be seen?)

The lighting is provided purely by the sun. I removed the HDRI skies and backgrounds.

To the left, just out of shot, is a set of glazed doors, through which the sun light enters. I adjusted the ISO, Aperture, and Shutter to give the exposure.

The materials used for the walls and floor are Thea materials, (Thea Matt White for the walls, and the tiled floor is Thea material as well.). I may have missed the areas around the built in column and ceiling though. The kitchen cabinets are models from WITTS kitchen via the 3D Warehouse. I did not apply any materials to these as they are a standard finish.

I did also create a completely separate model, where I just modelled the kitchen, added the doors in, added the same cabinets in, used the same settings, and it seemed to work ok. I used Presto AO on that one.

I then returned to this one, (the full house model), and tried the same again, but still very grainy.

Kind regards

Mike
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by MichaelSiggers » Thu Sep 07, 2017 9:19 am

Hieru wrote:It looks like a simple enough scene. The best thing to do is share it as a Thea pack - then it should be easy to figure out the reason for the noise.


I will do. Can you let me know how I share the Thea pack, please.

Kind regards

Mike
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by MichaelSiggers » Thu Sep 07, 2017 10:39 am

So, an update......

The attached image is using Presto AO, after only 20 or so minutes. A lot happier with this. I checked materials, and also returned some of the settings back to their default values.

I can not attach the Thea Package as it is too large. I'm guessing it is because it is the whole model.

As mentioned previously, I am in the process of learning this software, as I wish to use renders in some of the work for clients. Nothing majorly elaborate, but it does help show them the spaces created when extending their homes etc.

(Obviously the kitchen shown here was only created for practice purposes).

Kind regards

Mike
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Kitchen Render - Presto AO - 07SEPT17.jpeg
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by Frederik » Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:23 pm

Like I assumed...
You're only using the sun to light up the scene and have adjusted the ISO and shutter time, hence the extreme long time to clear up...

MichaelSiggers wrote:The attached image is using Presto AO, after only 20 or so minutes.

Of course it's much better, cause Presto AO is using Ambient Occlusion (hence the name AO), which means that every thing will get lit up a little and the light will bounce in the model resulting in a less noisy render...
However, it doesn't look natural...

MichaelSiggers wrote:I can not attach the Thea Package as it is too large.

You can always use Dropbox or alike to share large files... ;)

You can take a look and read through the posts in the Grainy Pic thread...
Although it's almost 10 years ago, all advices still apply... :)
Cheers
Kim Frederik

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by MichaelSiggers » Thu Sep 07, 2017 3:33 pm

Thank you Frederik

Very much appreciated.

Yes, while I think the AO is ok, it's not overal what I'm trying to achieve. Still good for a render to show clients the space etc. I do agree that MC is closer to real life. I think the other thing is, as I'm also a Professional Photographer, I'm approaching it from a photography point of view.

I'm currently back trying the Presto MC. I have reduced the model to the bare minimum, deleting everything that is not relevant. I've also triple checked all the materials and they are all Thea materials.

I've played with the 'Samples/pixels' value, and I think that is key. It's working well now, although the time to render is greater. Using the Bucket Render, I can clearly see the difference in my settings. Obviously, the higher the value, the longer it takes.

I think the thing is, as I'm only really delving into this now, I don't really have a benchmark on the time for a render. I realise it depends on a 1001 things, from the Model, the Scene, the Lighting, and the hardware. I'm using an i5 iMac with 16GB of RAM. Unfortunately I can not access the 2GB GPU. Something to do with CUDA from my previous research and my Driver, (supplied by Apple), not supporting it.

Anyway, I suppose as I'm not going to be rendering all day everyday, I can wait for the results when I need too.

Many thanks for the link to. That was one of the threads I had been reading.

Kind regards

Mike
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